Former Naafi building could now be listed, half way through demolition
ENGLISH Heritage is 'carefully considering' whether the partially demolished Hoe Centre should be listed.
English Heritage is looking at whether the former Naafi building in Notte Street has 'special architectural or historical interest to merit listing'. The building is currently being demolished for student housing, under a University of Plymouth project.
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If listed, the university will need 'listed building consent' to continue demolition work.
It is the latest hurdle to stall the project.
Work to knock down the building next to roadside hoardings was halted by the Health and Safety Executive at the weekend on public safety grounds.
The Herald understands talks are ongoing to resolve the situation while work to demolish the inside continues.
English Heritage said it hopes to advise the Culture Secretary whether it should be listed, over the next week.
English Heritage has not named the listing applicant but has confirmed it is 'carefully considering' whether it should be listed following new information about the building.
A spokesman said: "In particular, we are looking again at the significance of the architects who designed the building and the importance and rarity of purpose-built Naafi buildings."
English Heritage said it 'carefully assessed the post-war building' when it was originally asked to look at it in 2006 and 'that decision was upheld at review'.
The focus will now be on whether the new information submitted makes a difference. The spokesman said: "The fact that the building has been partially demolished will also be a factor in our decision-making."
A Facebook group has been set up with hundreds of members in opposition to the demolition. Joakim Boren, who set up the group, said: "It's up to the university what it wants to do with the building should demolition have to stop, but it could listen to the public. I would like to see an extension added onto the remaining structure."
Martin Berkien, university director of estates and facilities management, said that English Heritage is statutorily obliged to consider the new information.
He said the demolition work that is not subject to the HSE order is continuing 'so as to mitigate against rising costs'.
He also said the university is 'keen to avoid' a similar situation to the 2007 listing of the Civic Centre, which 'has had very significant cost implications which are ultimately paid for by the people of Plymouth'.
A Plymouth City Council spokesman said part of the building had already been destroyed adding: "A request was put forward to English Heritage for listing back in 2006. However, they decided not to list in that case.
"The Council does not intend to begin the process of issuing a Building Preservation Notice in such circumstances, which would only serve to delay demolition and the University's plans, and possibly add unnecessary costs to the process, which the Council could be potentially liable for.
"To apply for this notice, we would first need to approach the Secretary of State – by which time the building could have been demolished and it would be highly unusual to apply for a notice on an unlisted building.
"The University were within their rights to push ahead since it did not require planning permission. If the building was listed then it would have needed to apply for consent to demolish."
58 Comments
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by Mark Williams, Perth Western Australia
Saturday, July 17 2010, 9:02AM
“'special architectural or historical interest to merit listing'.
The building is ugly.
Knock it down, build something new and help pull Plymouth in to the modern day era.
You never know it might even brighten Plymouth up!!!”
by Sharon, Plymouth
Saturday, July 17 2010, 8:47AM
“J.Nolan, what the luftwaffe didn't get, the city planners did after the war. You think it's too little too late to save a building like the Hoe Centre?, if the good citizens of Plymouth had felt like that during the early 50's and 60's, we wouldn't have the Barbican as it is today, as our city planners were intent on demolishing the lot and putting up flats, very much like the short sighted ones in power today. It was a small group of people who saved the amazing Barbican and it was all from small beginnings. Maybe we can't save this one, but we have to try, and also, a lot of people who lived and studied in the Hoe Centre are actually fighting FOR it. If we don't have this diversity of design and vision,we may as well become like the shanty towns that the communist govt has put up in China. Would you be happy then?.”
by J Nolan, Not on Notte St
Friday, July 16 2010, 4:35PM
“I think the valuable lesson to be learnt here is to stop and take a fresh look at what little architectural gems of this period (post war) there is left. Plymouth is DULL when it comes to 95% of its buildings. YES the city is quite unique in that it had to start again after being flattened in WW2. The original plans to rebuild the city came to a grinding holt and the quality of the builds went when the money for the plan very quickly ran out.(Nothing changes there then !) Only a few iconic statements architecturally went up ie The Nat West building at the top of Royal Parade, Royal Parade itself and.... and.... Think that's it ! RP itself wouldn't look to bad if it was scrubbed up and given a face lift. We might actually appreciate the detail and design of these otherwise "concrete block" style constructions. Take a good look at how the Co-op/Derry's building has been kept in a good and clean condition. I'm sure it won't belong before we are fighting to save that as it will no doubt stand empty for years to come. (Anyone told John Lewis that this building is available btw ?)
I would have love something to have been done with the HC long before the bulldozers moved in. The building had suffered from neglect for decades. Ask anyone that studied and lived there.
We sadly have lost a few gems like the Luggage Store (Farley Building in its latter days, I think). The Silo in Milbay also (though that was doomed due to its internal construction left very little options for its use other than a grain silo). Lets use this lesson to save the gems that are left and to ensure we don't loose what little there is worth saving in this city.
Is anyone bothered with the state the Palace Theatre in Union St ? The old Pot Black snooker club in Duke St Devonport ? I'm sure there is plenty more empty and unused buildings that need some life bringing back into them but we have to be pragmatic and realistic about all of them. SOMONE has to pay or even want them. We need to think about building for the future and moving forward (something this city is appalling at) as well as saving quality examples from the past.
Lets try to live in the real world (not Plymouth). We have lost this one RIP Hoe Centre. Hello 2010 ! Maybe we should ask the Germans back to help us start from scratch again ? I have been to Berlin five times and every time I go I'm taken aback by what they have done. Not only from the flattened city it was after the war but since the reunification. New builds, 60's and 70's architecture are to be found everywhere. Even in what may to be considered to be the less "glamorous" parts of the city, they still look good because they look after what they have got.
PCC and the major building owners in this city. Arm yourselves with a fleet of cherry pickers and power hoses and clean the city up. Trust me it wouldn't look half as bad and may restore some much needed civic pride and actually get people interested in local their architecture.”
by GOM, Plymouth
Friday, July 16 2010, 5:29AM
“Here we go again! We are stuck with the ugly and crumbling Civic Centre because English Heritage, at the request of 6 people, listed it. Now we are at risk of being stuck with an empty, unfunctional Hoe Centre in order to support the whims of a small minority.
Before anyone jumps down my throat, yes I do know this building quite intimately inside and out. I am also in favour of Plymouth becoming a major worldwide centre for Education and Tourism. It is for these reasons that this decrepit building should be demolished immediately.”
by james, EGHD
Thursday, July 15 2010, 11:21PM
“What a mess went passed it this morning its been part demolished who in there right mind wants to keep an half demolished building and whos going to pay for it to be made safe .”
by James, St Judes
Thursday, July 15 2010, 9:00PM
“42, and anyone who enjoys debating the local issues, remember you can join iHerald, where any discussions stay on the site and can be returned to, rather than dissapearing with the stories. Yes, its mainly used for photos at the moment, but that's simply because there are only a few dozen people that use the message board within iHerald.”
by 42, cornwall
Thursday, July 15 2010, 5:37PM
“If this appears twice I apologise.
I have enjoyed this discussion, well done. I'm off for a beer”
by 42, cornwall
Thursday, July 15 2010, 5:35PM
“This has been a pretty good discussion, well done all of you!”
by Brian, Plymouth
Thursday, July 15 2010, 5:08PM
“If this building was so important to our architectural heritage (and I do not disagree with that presumption), why was it not listed years ago? Why wait until it is in the process of being demolished? And if it is owned by the University then they are to blame for its demolition not the Council. Or, as I rather suspect, is the Council quietly supporting this demolition purely because the powers in the Uni want it?”
by Engineer9, Plymouth
Thursday, July 15 2010, 3:08PM
“Reading back through this thread and others, I feel it needs to be pointed out that indeed the building is full of Asbestos, not all Asbestos requires complete atmosheric control during removal.
Also, the roof had leaked for a period of time leading to deterioration of the building.
I also hope that a more suitable use for this space is considered during the planning process following the demolition.”